Iteration of Ideas

Iteration of Ideas

Our world is full of surprises. The expected and simple interactions may lead to complex behaviors with unpredictability that surpasses our imagination. The behavior of many systems shows this "anomalies". They include the weather, the prey-predators societies and the Mandelbrot Set of equations. These systems show strange behaviors even though they originated from simple equations. Their complexity is amazing. They teach us a big lesson- don't assume and verify.

Let us start with a simple system- the growth of population. The population in a basic year shall grow at certain percentage of the previous year. There is a feedback in play here. When we increase the population this year from the previous, even the percentage of population growth is kept fixed, the number of population increases more rapidly as, say 4% of 100,000 is more than the previous year with less population. Could this formula go like this forever? The answer is no because eventually the available resources shall not be sufficient to sustain the exponentially growing population. Resources are available in limited supplies only. So, what happens? Very peculiar result are obtained in that we change the population growth rate, the output shall develop from linear, bifurcating into two values, four values and so on till we each a random state. It shall be very difficult to predict the population. The following diagram shows the bifurcation diagram where in where X {\displaystyle x_{n}} is a number between zero and one that represents the ratio of existing population to the maximum population possible

Iteration of Ideas

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The Mandelbrot feedback equation is again a reiterative equation of a very simple equation in which the output is feedback as an input in the equation. See this video to see how simplicity generates complexity.


Social Simple Interactions May Lead to Complexity

Humans interact and ides may become heavily populated and their growth may be limited by our capacity to fully comprehend them. The output of an idea may be the new input for more ideas. If too many people are engaged in the discussions so the rate of producing new ideas reach a value that our ideas may rearrange and produce a chaotic stage in which it shall be difficult to guess what shall happen next.

The complexity of social actions may experience the feedback effect. Our behaviors on social media might appear simple when they could hide surprises for us. We affect each others' thinking, emotions and understanding and the rate by which these changes could reach a level where chaos starts.

The use of equations to study human behaviors is not new. Kurt Lewin suggested that human behavior may be modeled by a simple equation:

BΒ =Β f(P,Β E), function of the person (p) and the environment (E). The significance of this equation is that we may express in words we may also express in equations. The equations may be not right and feedback from others may improve the equation. Lewin himself modified his initial equation to the present version. The equation allows for the person and his environment to have influence on their behavior in complex and profound ways. beBee is the environment and we may affect it and in turn the environment may affect us. What starts as a simple equation could develop into a complex one.

The Iteration of Ideas

I am writing this buzz because of a seed idea that started by suggesting an equation to reveal when we may move or take action. This was bases on an initial exchange of ideas among the triad of @Sara Jacobovici, @Franci Eugenia Hoffman and myself. The equation started with:

Knowing + Doing = Movement (Action).
So many ideas poured in resulting in its revision. In fact, the growth of ideas may have the shape of a tree. I shall be discussing this in a forthcoming buzz and I know Sara is writing a buzz too. It looks like the iteration of ideas may lead to complexity and find ourselves going into paths that we never predicted.

This is the beauty of simple equations as they too are subject to iteration. We don't have to be right or wrong as much as learning together and developing the simple equation. Who knows what results we shall end up with? Like the simple population equation led to complex behaviors, the exchange of ideas might do. Writing equations may reveal such complexities no matter how simple these equations are.

I believe it is the challenge of simplicity that carries the most pleasant surprises.


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Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#39
Steve Brady- amazing comment with its potential and practical examples.Led it and read it few times. Each time I ponder on this part "From my growing understanding of Fractal Perspectives it is from this state that we can see beautiful symmetries emerge and iterated patterns of coherent relationships emerge". Well, I see the patterns emerging when I read a comment by you. SOon, I am responding in a buzz to your very great comment. While reading this comment you really got me curious to read your comment on my following buzz. I feel you have so much to add: https://www.bebee.com/producer/@ali-anani/two-illusions-don-t-make-a-fact#c19

David Navarro LΓ³pez

David Navarro LΓ³pez

4 years ago #24

Katja Bader have a look here. Your point of view is requested

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#35
Your snowball example is simply genius. I know you wrote this comment partly from your own experiences, dear David Navarro L\u00f3pez. What a lovely illustration this is! Yes, we have nor control on the path of the snowball. es, we may have no control over the stones that may change the trajectory of the snowball, but we may always try again. Like you said, an oak tree doesn't produce pears. I feel you may extend this to a great buzz. You added a new meannig o the behavior of snowballs. We always need a fresh start.

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#34
#34 Dear David Navarro L\u00f3pez- this is a gem and your observation struck me too to the bones "One thought it shocked me to the bones, is that the day I stopped looking for explanations, is the day I started understanding life". SOmetimes we get over-stressed trying to understand and by doing that we are actually reducing our ability to understand. When things become too complex to understand, this is the time to relax and only then we may think of new approaches, new ideas and new thinking. There are so many things in life that we still don't understand. That is why I introduced the term "passionate curiosity".

David Navarro LΓ³pez

David Navarro LΓ³pez

4 years ago #21

#32
Part 2 But one thing was clear to me. (Again, a Spanish saying) You can not expect pears from an oak. So in order to promote the best scenario for both bees and hives, the only way I have found which is always certain, is to influence every action and ideas coming out with the highest human values. Here is, and only here, where we can have a part of control and responsibility about how things are going to develope, but just at the initial stage. You love analogies, and I like to look at it as a snow ball rolling down a hill. One can't know how it's going to end, but if one makes a big ball of "positive snow" and throws it aiming it in the right direction, it is more than probable it will end as you wished. Or maybe not. And if not, we can not run down to the hill and try to put away the stones that modified the trajectory of the ball. The ball will go faster, and stones are countless. Much better, make a new ball and aim it differently. If you are lucky, you will succeed. If not, better keeping "enhancing the ball" (which is under your direct control) rather than loosing the time asking why, as we can't be in two places at the same time.

David Navarro LΓ³pez

David Navarro LΓ³pez

4 years ago #20

#32
Part 1 Dear Ali, you know I am very interested in human behaviour, and I have been digging on it in any possible way a long time. One thought it shocked me to the bones, is that the day I stopped looking for explanations, is the day I started understanding life. Because as you are pointing out, "Humans interact and ideas may become heavily populated and their growth may be limited by our capacity to fully comprehend them" The feedback to our actions (or ideas), the more reach they achieve, the more complex they become. Being a practical man as I am, and having in mind the mentioned interacting between bees and hives, I switched from trying to understand the process, to trying to provoke the process in a trend it suited the mutual benefit fo bees and hives, due to the unavoidable fact that our energies and capabilitiy of comprehension are far too limited to reveal the ultimate consequences that feedback might cause modeling and transforming the original inception of it.

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#22
9 Steve Brady- your comment is a source of huge curiosity for me to find more from your experience ".what a thought provoking post. I have found many times that a simple, single social interaction, personal or virtual, can lead to pleasing complexities". Your examples shall be mind-provoking and I sincerely hope you share dew of them with us.

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#31
You are good for the bee and the hive my friend David Navarro L\u00f3pez. I am expecting a great comment from you

David Navarro LΓ³pez

David Navarro LΓ³pez

4 years ago #17

Only as an advance of a longer comment i will do later to your challenging buzz, (you know i like to ruminate) a Spanish saying says, what is good for the bee, is good for the hive, and what is good for the hive, is good for the bee.

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#25
Always I am motivated by your comments - thank you

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#20
Lovely example Deb Lange. The population equation sows when we may observe a linear growth. Yes, it is when the this rate goes high that we experience the complexity we observe.

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#18
Much obliged to your "oxygenated-comment" dear debasish majumder

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#17
Mohammed Sultan- it is simple rules that generate complexity. Changing the rate of population growth in the simple population equation led to complexity. We don't plan for it because it is an emerging one.

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#16
Thank you dearly Tausif Mundrawala

David B. Grinberg

David B. Grinberg

4 years ago #11

Ali, your deep thinking and intellect never cease to amaze. Thanks for more brilliant buzz!

Sara Jacobovici

Sara Jacobovici

4 years ago #10

#12
I am honoured by your response Ali Anani and grateful for our exchanges.

Harvey Lloyd

Harvey Lloyd

4 years ago #9

#10
Yes individually i believe we can advance within the Bebee environment. But to your post and the unsustainability question of population, i would ask is Bebee or any social media site furthering the forest or rather moving us away from consensus of sustainability? More a point of discussion without any data to support either side. I would state that social media has allowed for unique groups of beliefs to gather within a globalized platform. This is an observation of the question. My statement of the forest ruling the tree was pointed at the society we are creating will eventually dictate our actions, as it has in the past. Unsustainability will drive the survival need back to the forefront. From the strife exposed during our elections to technology replacing the consumers job, it all seems a bit irrational. We seem to be missing a common purpose that would define the forest. A forest is an ecosystem whereby each element is beneficial to the next. Bebee, social media or humans should share in a similar ecosystem. Unfortunately when we speak this way the word conformity comes into play and the needs of the individual espoused. This ecosystem discussion should not exclude the ideas of any, but rather bring the forest of ideas into a common purpose of a self-sustaining forest. I can't state with empirical evidence what is unsustainable but i suggest we all know what it looks like. But alas, Sara Jacobovici #9 "....and then we go off again, one idea leading to another, one question leading to another; what is life?"

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#11
This is a great comment Sara Jacobovici. Yes, it is the surprises that make this journey together a very pleasant one. You surprise me with your quality of comments. This in turn makes me even more grateful to you. Because you feel my gratitude *which is genuine) you tend to surprise me with another surprising comment, leading me to get more surprised and again influencing you. This is a feedback loop because what affects me affects you and in turn you affect me. It is this kind of loops that may develop into surprising things and unexpected one. In my exchanges of comments with you this has been the way we interacted. This is how new ideas are blossoming. I can't thank you enough dear Sara.

Sara Jacobovici

Sara Jacobovici

4 years ago #7

Dear Ali Anani, your buzz has produced the energy to spark the process of iteration of Ideas. I expressed to you that I consider myself a concepts person and that equations are out of my comfort zone and definitely your equations are way out of my league. But you have been very generous and supportive and allow me to see that I can enter this zone of equations in my own way. You write, "We don't have to be right or wrong as much as learning together and developing the simple equation." Thank you. I am in that process of looking at what started off as a simple idea and experiencing it branching off as a result of the dynamic exchanges through your buzzes and discussions from your readers. In this buzz I pick up on the discussion of predictability and surprises. One of the things that makes you such a great observer and teacher, Dr. Ali, is that in spite of predictability, you are open to, invite and are excited about surprises. If we knew it all from studying the function and simply create equations to communicate that function, we would truly be in a box without an exit. But it's the surprises that allow us to navigate through the Mandelbox and exit to see the light.

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#8
Harvey Lloyd- if we extend your analogy to beBee a bee represents a tree and forest equates to the forest. Are we on the edge of survival or have we moved beyond as we are "because if "the higher callings of intellect". Yes, studying one bee is needed, but also the collective actions. The beBee society shall eventually rule the bee even the bee shall advance by interactions with other bees.

Sara Jacobovici

Sara Jacobovici

4 years ago #5

#1
#3 #5 #7 @Max Carter, in a formal research endeavor, conceptual definitions would need to be clearly presented. I have no doubt that you see your equation DESIRE=LIFE as the only equation that makes sense, yet since we are biological, organic, sensory beings that create meaning from our sensory experiences, what makes sense to you conceptually does not equate with what makes sense to me. No doubt you can produce examples of your equation. I have many examples of individuals whose desire was extremely strong and viable but could not sustain life....as we know it.... and then we go off again, one idea leading to another, one question leading to another; what is life?

Harvey Lloyd

Harvey Lloyd

4 years ago #4

Human behavior can be reviewed from the individual or the masses. Like the trees the single tree can be studied and we can gather information, when we look at the forest though, we must look up from the individual and quantify the whole and its purpose or goals. Is the forest sustainable in its current mode? From an individual perspective i believe the answer would be yes today, tomorrow is another story. The forest will eventually rule the tree. Our purpose not too long ago was quite simple, survive. Conformity was expected as a part of an integrated society that required each others skills and knowledge. With technology and greatly enhanced productivity, we have been able to separate ourselves from the edge of survival. We now seek higher callings of intellect. A smart forest is a good thing but not when it elevates us above the fundamentals of survival. Many great nation-states have come and gone over the millennia, all shared this very common thread of collapse. Thanks for the post Ali Anani

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#5
In fact, you surpassed me.

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#3
No, because they accomplished what they did after increasing their ability. Only then the desire fuel led to results. But again, these discussions show the value of simple equations (the theme of this buzz) to open discussion points.

Ali 🐝 Anani, Brand Ambassador @beBee

#1
A very simple equation is that performance = desire X ability. Desire alone without ability is useless.

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